DTR Radios - Gen1 vs Gen2

[Mr.X]

Hello everyone!

New user, so if this is posted in the wrong area, hopefully the mods will move it to the proper forum.

I recently purchased 4 used DTR radios, the keyboard and a cloning cable. I now have 1 650 and 3 550s. I tried to do as much research as I could about these radios beforehand, but there is almost nothing written about them, and Motorola themselves were not any real help as they don't seem to know much about them either. It's only after I found this forum and a couple of others that I was able to piece together a little information about the radios, and now that I have them in my hand and have tested them, I am starting to get the hang of them. I wish I knew then what I know now before I bought them!

Not knowing that there were 2 versions of the DTR radios, I believe that I unfortunately purchased Gen1 radios, and probably paid too much for them. They all have stubby antennas which are not removable. Is that how one can tell they are Gen1? I don't see anything in the menus that shows a version #.
I have also learned that Gen1's will not work with the free CPS software from Motorola, but if I have a Gen2, I can program it and then clone the Gen1s with my cloning cable.
The feature I REALLY need access to on these Gen1s is the volume of the "Talk Permit" beep. It's louder than the voice of the caller and really annoying. I see in the CPS software there's an offset adjustment for this, and I would love to use that to turn down that beep. The question is whether or not that function is valid on the Gen1 radios.
I don't have a Gen2 radio or the programming cable yet to allow me to test this.

Also, is it possible to flash update the Gen1 radios to Gen2?
Is there a Gen3?

Thank you in advance for any and all help. Much appreciated!

[POVoutfitters]

I've also noticed that there is very little information on these radios. Advanced programming takes a while to understand, and is very much a lot of trial and error.

I am working from memory, so this information may be slightly incorrect.

DTR 550 and 650 units with stubby, non-removable antenna are generation 1. Generation 2 DTR 550 and 650 radios have removable antennas and are flash upgradable.

There appears to be a third generation, which is flash update to Generation 3 radios:
According to a Service Brief, this generation adds the following features:
• OTA fleet cloning
• Talk Permit Tone (TFT) independent volume control
• Disable Radio PTT when accessory with remote PTT
• Voice VibraCall
• Backward compatible with old firmware radio
• Serial cloning all settings along with the contacts and text messages
• Private Reply with a Group Call
• Louder audio for remote speakers
• Option to disable front-panel radio programming
• Read Private ID also reads fields other than just PID

To get the adjustable PTT volume, it appears to need a later model generation 2 or 3 radio, with the firmware upgrade to generation 3.
Also, some of the generation 1 radios are not programmable from the computer cable, they can be cloned only.
The best way to overcome this limitation is to have one "latest generation" radio as your "master" radio that you load all your talkgroup and radio ID information into from the the computer. Then use this "master" radio to clone to the other radios. With other generation 2 & 3 radios, you can wirelessly clone and the "master" radio will individually transmit the information to each other radio in the fleet.

Part of the problem with these radios is that they appear to share their heritage with Nextel radios, which explains the use of the same connector as i730 power/data connectors.

The computer programming cable is a serial cable, none of the phone data cables with USB connectors will work. Motorola part #B007IAWXA0

The cloning cable simply plugs one DTR radio into another. Motorola part #53968

To upgrade firmware, you HAVE to have the Flash cable NNTN6367. This is an EXPENSIVE cable, currently about $80.
You may be able to find someone who used to do Nextel/Boost iDen phone flashing that will loan or sell you this cable much cheaper.

(In a semi-related note, if you want to see a very interesting use of DTR radios, search ebay for Cane Wireless Motorola DTR repeater)

Feel free to PM me if you have any further questions.
Rob

[Mr.X]

That is great info, Rob. Thank you so much! PM sent.

So glad I found this forum, I've been hunting around for quite some time and not finding much of anything on the 'net!

[wavetar]

Also, is it possible to flash update the Gen1 radios to Gen2?
Is there a Gen3?

Rob gave you lots of good information, but I don't believe he addressed the upgrading of the Gen 1 units. Unfortunately, the answer is no, you cannot flash upgrade a Gen 1.

There's not really a 'Gen 3', but As Rob alluded, there is newer firmware, which is used with version 3.x of the CPS, and can be flashed into any Gen 2.

Gen 2 units with the stubby get approx 20% greater range over the Gen 1 units, and 40% with the long antenna...according to Motorola. There's no doubt they have much improved range.

The Gen 2's also have a redesigned battery latch and some other minor chassis upgrades.

[Mr.X]

Thank you very much!

This is the best information I've ever been able to get on these radios.

I understand that the Gen1 is stuck with it's firmware and cannot be upgraded or directly programmed using CPS.
So I assume that even if a Gen3 were programmed with a feature like a lowered PTT tone volume, cloning a Gen1 from the Gen3 using the cloning cable would not make the Gen1 follow that specific setting, correct?

[wavetar]

So I assume that even if a Gen3 were programmed with a feature like a lowered PTT tone volume, cloning a Gen1 from the Gen3 using the cloning cable would not make the Gen1 follow that specific setting, correct?

That is correct.

[Mr.X]

So I assume that even if a Gen3 were programmed with a feature like a lowered PTT tone volume, cloning a Gen1 from the Gen3 using the cloning cable would not make the Gen1 follow that specific setting, correct?

That is correct.

Bummer.

[Mr.X]

Where can I get details on the Cane Wireless Repeater?
I went to their website but there's no info there; Sent them an e-mail but no reply....

Love to see an owner's manual for it.

[Mr.X]

There's not really a 'Gen 3', but As Rob alluded, there is newer firmware, which is used with version 3.x of the CPS, and can be flashed into any Gen 2.

Ok, I have 10 used DTR550 radios with the removable antennas. I have the CPS cable and can program them with the CPS software, and the firmware shows up as R5E.03.03 so I gather that they are Gen2 radios. (I also have some Gen1 which have non-removable antennas and will not connect to CPS)

So, today I received my flash cable. Hooked it up to my new DTR650 which did not have the latest firmware. Using the flash cable I was able to upgrade the firmware to Rev3 (R5E.06.00)!

Next, I grabbed one of my DTR550 radios, and tried to flash it. Disappointingly, it starts the first part of the flash, then comes back with the following error message:
Error> unable to flash due to unsupported radio version
Please upgrade to Gen3, then flash again.

All of the DTR550 that I have give the same error when trying to flash.
I have 2 versions of the Flash software, one for the DTR650, the other for the DTR550/410, and neither will work. (The 650 software comes back with an error that it's the wrong radio)

If it's not completely hopeless, it sounds like I need to flash update the radio to an "interm" version of the firmware and then flash to R5E.06.00?

Any suggestions?

[Mr.X]

Where'd everybody go?

[Smoothdog0]

i have 2 motorola dtr 550 radios both gen 3 one has slightly newer firmware than the other radio, both purchased about a year apart, i have the cps software and the cps programming serial cable, what do i need to flash both radios to the newwest firmware? i see there is a usb flash cable? if so where can i purchase one and where do i obtain the flash software or files for the flash software?

thank you for any help

-Brian.

[Mr.X]

Hook them up to CPS and tell us what version of firmware is currently on the radios.
My older 550's have R5E.03.03 and the newest firmware available is R5E.06.00. Anything older than R5E.03.03 is likely a Rev1 and will not connect to CPS.

[Smoothdog0]

i hooked them up to the cps
radio a: R5E.06.00
radio b: R5E.03.03

[Mr.X]

radio b: R5E.03.03

You're in the same boat as me there. Still searching for a solution but unsuccessful so far.

[Mr.X]

Anyone know a Motorola dealer/service center who could get us the skinny on what needs to happen regarding updating R5E.03.03 to R5E.06.00?
I called Motorola and they were no help at all.

[Mr.X]

I have the solution if anyone's interested. I wrote a blog about it.

http://www.checkcheckonetwo.com/forum/s ... Start-Here